tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post1231824065633525368..comments2024-03-28T03:08:44.068-07:00Comments on Cliff Mass Weather Blog: Lightning, the "Crouch", and Joan BaezCliff Mass Weather Bloghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13948649423540350788noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-42741240702633489512021-06-23T09:46:02.980-07:002021-06-23T09:46:02.980-07:00coronavirus.coronavirus.sebodoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18066358448072548127noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-39708588845608698992009-08-16T22:11:50.541-07:002009-08-16T22:11:50.541-07:00Once when I was solo backpacking in the Great Basi...Once when I was solo backpacking in the Great Basin a large thunderstorm began to move closer and closer. I was in flat sagebrush country, no trees, no low places apart from small, shallow, dry gullies. I ended up quickly hiking back to a small meadow along a stream with rock outcrops rising on both sides and crouched in my tent as the storm arrived and boomed and slung large hailstones (for Oregon that is). I get really scared when I'm alone backpacking and a storm comes! I probably shouldn't have been in my tent, but I really did NOT want to see the lightning and get more frightened. What would have been the best place to be in? Between rock outcrops in a tiny "valley"? Crouching in the open? I'm sure it will happen again because it scares me so much.scrubjay93https://www.blogger.com/profile/05939841675824981017noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-17228259518338056172009-08-16T20:55:49.853-07:002009-08-16T20:55:49.853-07:00Cliff, you forgot the most obvious parallel to you...Cliff, you forgot the most obvious parallel to your story. Forty Years ago - to the day - Joan Baez performed at Woodstock where the Lightening conditions and concerns were identical.Clay Swidlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11636220866156382570noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-65287479447607849222009-08-14T23:50:47.349-07:002009-08-14T23:50:47.349-07:00Hehehe -- that was funny mainstreeter!
I could us...Hehehe -- that was funny mainstreeter!<br /><br />I could use more tips on recognizing storm systems from a distance that look to have lightning potential. <br /><br />Once, hiking near Teanaway, we decided to return to the car after having been checking the plants blooming near a fire lookout. And in the 30 - 45 minutes it took us to drive back down the mtn a torrent of rain and lightning strikes on either side of I90 started booming. I was so grateful we'd left when we had, but sheepish I hadn't made the connection to the weather visible to the West.Jessicahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09764322294547172508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-52026962186345036102009-08-14T22:10:17.038-07:002009-08-14T22:10:17.038-07:00one more thing since larry rice is on here... plea...one more thing since larry rice is on here... please do not be so seattle centric with your weather forcasts! We have weather here in centralia/chehalis too!Diary of a cat householdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03740567152994415008noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-36589938964335008622009-08-14T22:06:13.061-07:002009-08-14T22:06:13.061-07:00i was in spanaway/parkland one time and my car got...i was in spanaway/parkland one time and my car got hit by lighting... that was a weird experience!Diary of a cat householdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03740567152994415008noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-43280141596802641072009-08-14T21:54:01.733-07:002009-08-14T21:54:01.733-07:00The problem being near a metal tower is two fold.....The problem being near a metal tower is two fold...one..lighting can jump from it to you. Second..current can descend the tower and spread out along the surface...and give you a shock if you are nearby...<br /><br />Lightning is quite complex...a stepped leader descends from the clouds in a series of rapid steps. It is when the leader is above you that hair stands up. At the same time, upward electrical channels rise from the earth...when they meet a lightning flash occurs.Cliff Mass Weather Bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13948649423540350788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-1739311900734763802009-08-14T20:21:32.261-07:002009-08-14T20:21:32.261-07:00When you say go indoors, I'm still curious as ...When you say go indoors, I'm still curious as to what counts as indoors and/or safe?<br /><br />A car is ok because it acts as a cage. Why wouldn't under a metal tower also act as a cage?<br /><br />A house is ok, but it doesn't really seem like a cage to me. It could be considered a short fat tree.<br /><br />Real tree is a no no, that seems clear.<br /><br />Tent, no.<br /><br />What about under a parmanent metal roof like you might see in the picnic area of a park?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13973794592900892256noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-54268737655413951202009-08-14T18:58:02.562-07:002009-08-14T18:58:02.562-07:00Does this mean the animals in the zoo with horns w...Does this mean the animals in the zoo with horns will need lightning arrestors installed?mainstreeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06311958194036737432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-66842753321525933232009-08-14T18:21:47.798-07:002009-08-14T18:21:47.798-07:00I was just watching a show on lightning over the w...I was just watching a show on lightning over the weekend(on the discovery channel) and it showed that lighting can come from the ground up. Believe this was via the 'step leader'. But think it usually starts from the thunder cloud and works it`s way to the ground or tallest object to strike. We only see it coming and or appearing to come from the cloud because we cant see it happen in supper slow motion like a camera can.andycottlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12696751462397354299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-76537430108872401772009-08-14T17:17:56.110-07:002009-08-14T17:17:56.110-07:00Great post, Cliff. One question I've had about...Great post, Cliff. One question I've had about lightning and trees and such is if you're on a walk through a forest, you're kind of surrounded by tall lightning rods. What to do then?<br /><br />Another situation. Last month, I was on the Seattle-to-Portland bike ride, and we were riding out of Chehalis, there was a lightning storm with strikes very close. Our choices were to keep riding through the farm fields, or to go hide by one of the sparse trees. I suppose I could have banged on the door of a farmhouse and begged shelter, but then there were 5,000 other cyclists out that same morning. So we just kept riding... any thoughts?Thomas Eric Ruthfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14787924087264589777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-59624205661816375142009-08-14T16:50:38.804-07:002009-08-14T16:50:38.804-07:00BTW: lab studies have shown that a wooden stick is...BTW: lab studies have shown that a wooden stick is just as likely to attract lightning as a metal pole. Lightning is not that discriminating. <br /><br />Also this below is from struckbylightning.org from Mike Utley, who speaks with authority as someone who was struck by lightning and has devoted his life to educating others:<br /><br />Lightning safety has evolved over the years so now when we talk about the 30-30 Rule, instead of standing outside and counting, go inside and count. When Thunder Roars Go Indoors !<br /><br />The ‘Lightning Squat or Crouch’ is no longer taught since it probably does nothing and give a false sense of security.<br /><br />5 Levels of Lightning Safety<br /><br />• Schedule out door activities to avoid lightning.<br /><br />• Know when & where to be in a safe place. When you hear thunder go to a safe place & stay there for 30 minutes after last thunder.<br /><br />• Avoid dangerous locations/activities (elevated places, open ares, tall isolated objects) & water related activities ( swimming, boating, near water) DO NOT GO UNDER TREES !<br /><br />• Last minute risk reduction, including the ‘lightning crouch’ is a joke & probably does nothing at all. THERE IS NO PLACE SAFE OUTSIDE IN A THUNDER STORM<br /><br />• First Aid: Immediately start CPR !<br /><br />• If you do not follow the 1st 5, call Coroner & Priest <br /><br />Source: From Mike Utley's blog struckbylightning.orgLarry Ricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02345295142958156146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-1630939353796066902009-08-14T16:44:49.468-07:002009-08-14T16:44:49.468-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Larry Ricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02345295142958156146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-84643073226349186142009-08-14T15:12:05.378-07:002009-08-14T15:12:05.378-07:00I've heard that lightning actually goes from t...I've heard that lightning actually goes from the ground up. Is that true? It looks like it comes down from the sky to me.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16950995407603592455noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-1349277357809688402009-08-14T14:18:22.724-07:002009-08-14T14:18:22.724-07:00Lightning looks for the greatest concentration of ...Lightning looks for the greatest concentration of potential.<br /><br />Potential gathers most at high or pointed objects.<br /><br />At the Woodland Park Zoo, there is a very tall water tower (an enormous repository of ground potential) and right next to it is the Norse Home, with lots of pointy corners and antennas. As the most likely lightning targets in the vicinity, I would be extremely surprised if they weren't equipped with lightning rods.<br /><br />The likelihood of people in the Zoo north field being hit would be pretty small in comparison.Ted Sternhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15298055747984752174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-56888052026481620522009-08-14T13:53:26.586-07:002009-08-14T13:53:26.586-07:00I'm fully aware of the danger that lightning p...I'm fully aware of the danger that lightning presents, but what the heck? Having lived for more than 26 years in a place where thunderstorms (many of them severe) happen on a regular basis throughout the summer, I never heard of such a thing as crouching during a lightning storm. I went running during storms, sat outside, etc. and really only got scared if there was the possibility of a tornado (which is also not uncommon).<br /><br />Relax, people. You're probably not going to get struck by lightning.Lizhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08514758416090020263noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-55859873733663901202009-08-14T12:41:33.696-07:002009-08-14T12:41:33.696-07:00Yes, when your hair stands on end, a lightning str...Yes, when your hair stands on end, a lightning strike is about to happen over or near you. Crouch down and start praying!Cliff Mass Weather Bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13948649423540350788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-39278743296170589672009-08-14T10:17:13.036-07:002009-08-14T10:17:13.036-07:00Hey folks! Your best lightning safety tip is to r...Hey folks! Your best lightning safety tip is to read Dan's post above. Paying attention to that "hair standing on end" feeling is your main key to safety. "Crouch" immediately!! You have only seconds! Before a lightning bolt is created, the local electric field must become high enough to ionize the air (tens of thousands of volts per meter). Sometimes, this buildup happens so quickly that there is simply no time to crouch. Also, for folks my age, it's not possible to spend 15-20 minutes in a crouched position waiting for a storm to pass, so you need to know when to "assume the position". So, pay attention to those arm hairs! Also, before a strike corona discharge will occur on high tops of conductive objects around you. At night, you will see a spray of electricity (historically called St. Elmo's Fire) and you best run 50-100 ft. away and "Crouch" immediately! In daylight, you see nothing, but if it is quiet and you are paying attention, you will hear the soft buzzing of the corona discharge appear. Run away from this sound and crouch! Most of the time, we get the advance warning that Dan documents.Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09726805396038087981noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-66450956294528249002009-08-14T10:07:23.293-07:002009-08-14T10:07:23.293-07:00The UK TV show Top Gear tested the safety of cars ...The UK TV show Top Gear tested the safety of cars in lightening.<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ve6XGKZxYxAtipo158https://www.blogger.com/profile/18210397470740335277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-65223598969902244202009-08-14T09:01:20.063-07:002009-08-14T09:01:20.063-07:00Metal golf cleats make your shoes a better conduct...Metal golf cleats make your shoes a better conductor with the ground. Remember with lighting, being insulated from the ground helps somewhat.... In a direct hit, I doubt it would matter much though.GaryP.https://www.blogger.com/profile/16946775119505539856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-57812160061704292422009-08-14T08:33:34.109-07:002009-08-14T08:33:34.109-07:00Once my Dad was going to go golfing with the threa...Once my Dad was going to go golfing with the threat of lightning lurking. He told me, "It's okay, I'll just use my one-iron. Not even God can hit a one-iron."Katiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08986037474152101242noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-28996860723623829222009-08-14T08:14:39.546-07:002009-08-14T08:14:39.546-07:00A relative of mine was shocked after lightning hit...A relative of mine was shocked after lightning hit a tree several feet from a shed in which she'd taken cover. This was in the South, but if there is lightning it can happen anywhere. Golfers would often get zapped down there. Scary.Big White Ballhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06481312150639291550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-33815850952890153422009-08-14T07:17:38.287-07:002009-08-14T07:17:38.287-07:00Golf shoes nowdays have plastic cleats. Why would ...Golf shoes nowdays have plastic cleats. Why would they be dangerous in a lightening storm?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04682453612201774748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-38079530791262617712009-08-14T02:40:19.168-07:002009-08-14T02:40:19.168-07:00It might also help us lay folk if you would add wh...It might also help us lay folk if you would add what signs or sensations to look for ahead of adopting that lightning crouch, and, once crouching, how long to hold it. Many people have a social aversion to being seen doing something that looks silly, and probably won't hold the pose for more than a few seconds if lightning doesn't strike immediately. Also, there are many people who, because of physical limitations, couldn't hold a crouch for more than a few seconds anyway. Would kneeling with legs together be an acceptable alternative for them?<br /><br />Recap:<br /><br />1) What clues does one look for to suspect that close-range lightning is imminent?<br /><br />2) How long should one hold that pose if retreat to a safer location isn't an option?<br /><br />3) What about kneeling instead of crouching?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04231172437768405466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7478606652950905956.post-22350126882632415352009-08-14T00:03:38.827-07:002009-08-14T00:03:38.827-07:00The one time lightning struck nearby (about 2 bloc...The one time lightning struck nearby (about 2 blocks), I had a feeling it was going to happen as my hair stood up for about 20 seconds before it struck. A very distinctive feeling (harkens back to holding onto a Van de Graff generator for a static electricity demonstration)Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02202692259718746720noreply@blogger.com